Google and Dell Team Up For Evil/Spyware?

Javier Writes:

Hey Frank
are you aware of this?
http://blog.opendns.com/2007/05/22/google-turns-the-page/

That is a great piece in the OpenDNS blog Javier. Basically Dell has facilitated the installation of this insidious spyware type program that serves Google advertising on error, only it is practically impossible for the regular user to remove.

Quote:  "This page isn’t being shown to Dell owners just because they have the Google Toolbar. In fact, uninstalling the Google Toolbar won’t get rid of it. Dell and Google are now installing a second program on computers that intercepts all sorts of queries that the browser would normally try to resolve. This program has no clear name and is very hard to uninstall...

"Not only that, but due to some support inquiries we’ve gotten it seems like this software is being installed on older Dell computers that use some sort of automatic update service from Dell."

This is not the Google I know and love.

Comments

[B]

That's not Google doing that -- That is Dell, and Gateway, and AOL, and any other large company that works with google. All they are doing is taking an "Enterprise" version of AFD and making there own error search pages, which according to you yesterday (http://com.com) is not so bad. You can uninstall it after all, unlike the .cm fiasco which the ever EVIL Yahoo must be behind since it is their ads on those pages.

***FS*** Thanks for your comment B. I'm certainly not enamored with .cm.. but if OpenDNS is calling it correctly then insidious uninstallable software is OKAY as long as it comes from Dell 'powered by Google.' seems like a team effort to OpenDNS.. and to me.

[Sahar Sarid]

It is a deal between Dell and Google. This is not done by Dell alone.
http://news.com.com/2100-1032_3-6077051.html

[David Ulevitch]

I point the finger at Google since they are hosting the pages and enabling the monetization:

http://www.google.com/hws/dell/afe?hl=en&s=http://linux.xom
http://www.google.com/hws/gateway/afe?hl=en&s=http://linux.xom
http://www.google.com/hws/sony/afe?hl=en&s=http://linux.xom
http://www.google.com/hws/emachines/afe?hl=en&s=http://linux.xom

Frank, I didn't quite understand your response in the comment above. What's a team effort?

***FS*** Dell+GOOG=Team

As for .cm, I don't think it's very good. It is clever for sure, but not very good. If I'm Hawaiian Airlines and someone types in www.hawaiianairlines.cm then why should my ad be there? They clearly are intending to go to hawaiianairlines.com... I'm gonna find some stats on what .cm type-in's happen most often. I bet they are all trademarked terms.

***FS*** I agree that I don't like it.. I disagree they are 'all tm terms' .

[B]

Hardware manufacturers have for years bundled software with their computers to subsidize the costs to the end user. I for one reinstall from scratch every time I get a new computer for this very reason. But I assure you that it is not as difficult to uninstall as they are very broadly leading you to believe. And like I said before it is not Google -- Dell simply has a Enterprise Domain feed that is simply a URL that Dell and Gateway and AOL forward the user to. It is the same as setting your default address bar search engine to Google, or Yahoo or whatever you choose, but the copmany (dell in this case) make a rev-share on the profits and gets a little more branding in the process. Now you and I both know how to change these settings, and my Mother may not know how to do it, so she would just be stuck with it, but at least it is a page with relevant results -- not like .cm. I for one have followed the .cm for many months now, and contrary to what the article said I knew Kevin / HitFarm were the people powering the Agogo system, and I thought it was common knowledge (to people that would read this blog anyways). And while I do not personally see anything wrong with it, I simply want to point out that you should be as much against .cm as you are against .cpm. After all I am sure that Kevin is stealing traffic from your domains as well!

***FS*** That is true.. I am loosing traffic to this too. I am not enamored with what's going on there. Thanks sincerely for your comment B.. My comment re: GOOG is simply that many folks mistakenly believe that GOOG gets all that trraffic simply because they are a useful search utility. That is not the only reason that the world beats a path to their door.

[Sahar Sarid]

"My comment re: GOOG is simply that many folks mistakenly believe that GOOG gets all that trraffic simply because they are a useful search utility. That is not the only reason that the world beats a path to their door."

If my memory serves me right, their sales force is about 8,000+ from their total 12,000 employees. It is a total illusion thanks of an amazing PR machine that it is their search technology that brings people to sign up with adwords/adsense/corporate accounts.

[Jeff]

Dell Computers used to be good. Now their finance department and also their computers suck.

[David Ulevitch]

Well said Sahar.

Frank -- You're right. I didn't mean to write that the .cm typos are all trademark related. I meant that the top ones probably are.

***FS*** Agree.. but it looks like those ones have actually been registered by nefarious third parties.. not wildcarded agoga traffic.

google.cm, youtube.cm, etc.

But of course business.cm is probably pretty good too. :-)

***FS*** I'm sure the owner of business.com is no more thrilled than I am about my generics garnering the occaisional .cm typo.. Same as what happens in the address bar with .xom, .cpm etc.

My big take on this is the gravity of the doublestandard.. takes error search with dell and in Firefox and that's somehow okay.. Well it's no more okay than .cm. Which I don't like either.

[B]

Sahar --

So are you insinuating that there is a better search engine out there? I mean when I need to do research on any subject I usually start there. I am not sure if the bias from you guys is simply that you have yahoo feeds, or what but I feel like I am in the dark here. What search engine do you use?

[B]

"I point the finger at Google since they are hosting the pages and enabling the monetization:"

So point the finger at Google and Yahoo for every parked domain you see, that is a possible TM domain. I mean they are driven by XML feeds from one of the 2 companies. Simply because the URL starts with google.com means nothing. All error search pages, TM parked domains, and any other dirty traffic source usually ends up pulling keywords requests from google or yahoo. I haven't seen Yahoo called evil or dirty because of th .cm fiasco. I think it is amazing that this much animosity is shown toward Google because of a default search engine pre-populated in a dell computer, and how none of this was shown toward Yahoo when the *.cm was discussed yesterday. Look how people freaked out when netsol did the same thing -- They put a *.* on all domains they had control of and everyone freaked. Crazy! I mean you could say that Google is a smart company because they worked a deal with firefox to handle all of there error searches, but instead they are just called thieves. How can this be such a biased issue?

[Sahar Sarid]

"

Sahar --

So are you insinuating that there is a better search engine out there? I mean when I need to do research on any subject I usually start there. I am not sure if the bias from you guys is simply that you have yahoo feeds, or what but I feel like I am in the dark here. What search engine do you use?
"

There are many better engines out there, depands on products/services you want. If you want books Amazon is better. If you want auctions ebay is better. if you want domain names afternic and sedo are better.

As for what I use, mostly our own internal search engine, spent close to three years to build it. Soon will make it public.

I don't think any of us hate Google, Yahoo, MSN .. we just point the issues as we see them. We do the same when we see issues in the domain land.

[Salman]

I heard that Google makes roughly $25 per year for every toolbar installation. If google is paying Dell to have their toolbar preinstalled on their machines, it could really help them keep their costs down. You also have to factor in how much user data is worth to google, especially on the scale of computers sold by Dell.

(BTW Frank, what is your email address? I think emailing you on [email protected] is pretty much useless right? You must get thousands of emails on that one!)

[David Wrixon]

Last three computers have been Dell.

Looks like it is time for a change.

[Eric D]

Frank – I am with you there!

What rubs me the wrong way is that there is such a strong PR campaign with the whole “Do no Evil” line that the masses have been lining up for the cool-aid sometimes coming back for seconds. We are fed this line that Google is just good at doing business but it is never shady. I am a bit sick and tired of reading about how type-in traffic is shady – how – how is it shady? – people want RumCakes – well they get it!

Just like the Dell example above – you have a hard time telling what are the Ads and what are the search results. Kind of like this AdSense premier partner – (www.askbaby.com) – take a look and see if you can find the Ads. Tell me that tricking people converts well!

The whole Google Toolbar and this Dell trickery is 100% Spyware – no doubt about it.

The more you point it out – the more I feel like chanting to the sheep that ohh so poignant Public Enemy refrain – “Don’t believe the Hype!”

[Javier Marti]

As time goes by, Google will start to pay the price for being number one. Their previous (current?) motto "Don't be evil" just makes matters worse.
I think Google is being led too agressively towards the money making side of things, and the guys in the PR departments have to deal with these storms later. They should balance their priorities and public perception before they make this kind of deals. Today it is google, but expect more evil deals in the months to come.
I think that the idealistic spirit on which the company was built is quickly vanishing.
Some days ago I predicted in my personal blog that at some point, Google may well be forced to split up somehow. I know it is an outrageous claim today, but most people and companies underestimate the power of public perception. We can see the public's perception of Google changing very rapidly before our eyes, with and without reason. People hate number ones, that's why -responding to a previous comment- they'll go heavier on Google than on Yahoo making the .cm deal.
We just saw all this with Microsoft some years ago. Same thing:
1) company offers quality
2) company grows and becomes market leader
3) people start to dislike them (with or without reason). At the same time, due simpply to their speed of growth, they start to take the "wrong" decisions, and their corporate image suffers.
4) they make enemies all over the place, since they became so big that they start to choke the niche niche players
5) they may be sued (it has already started with Viacom) or their products boycotted in many different ways (remember McDonalds related riots in France)
6) once they are sued, the judges are influenced by public perception against the company (although they shouldn't be) and the company is seriously and excessively fined ("after all, they can pay") or forced to split in one way or another. That was the beginning of the end for Msoft (that and many strategic mistakes along the way)
In essence, most people in this society, as Mark J. in his recent article puts it, hate number ones. It is psychological and unavoidable. Human nature. Will always be so.
Domainers and other successful people would do well to keep a low profile. If the "what is in it for me" question is increasingly unanswered for most people, expecting them to react in any other way presuposses most individuals have an intelligence and good heart that unfortunately, most lack.

regards
Javier
Trendirama.com

***FS*** Great comment Javier

[Drewbert]

>What search engine do you use?

Give http://search411.com a try - just keep the search terms simple for now - it's still being tuned.

***FS*** Wow cool Drew.